Feeling Downtrodden? Welcome to the 50's again.

You want change then you better want to take it. This ain't a movie to sit back and watch, you better all want to be actors.

CoH, act like adults. And don't use this as some sort of platform to complaining who is at fault, we all at fault baby!

25 votes

#1 - Tue May 31, 2011 6:30 PM EDT

Shannoscubie

You deserve the "magic" biscuits for this one! Good doggie!!

13 votes

#1.1 - Tue May 31, 2011 7:23 PM EDT

MWeaver

Well said, sir.

15 votes

#1.2 - Tue May 31, 2011 8:12 PM EDT

Citizen Kane-473667

Not sure Vlad what would scare the Powers That Be more; pissed off bunch of "kids" in the streets raising Hell or us old fogies waving our canes at them right there along side them. ;o)

15 votes

#1.3 - Tue May 31, 2011 8:45 PM EDT

Hugo C. Gonzalez 76

Holy crap you made me shake as I finished the article, But I hate crowds, I really do, but I am pissed off. maybe my anger will conquer my fear!

8 votes

#1.4 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:44 PM EDT

Fufu

...us old fogies waving our canes at them right there along side them.

And get the hell off my lawn, too.

10 votes

#1.5 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 8:09 AM EDT

Davy-755715

I guess it depends on one's point of view. I remember the 50's also. Though seemingly far away, the cold war was ever present. Of course, my time was only beginning, and I was fortunate enough to have a father who was gainfully employed, in a work environment that seemed far more stable and well-paying than what we see today.

That last part is what scares me most about today. The factories destroyed in WWII have been rebuilt, and the rest of the world has long since begun manufacturing in a big way. In the US program of artificially continuing the good times, we have imported everything that we could, and exported the living-wage jobs that the average American used to earn providing those products. The first widespread effect of the morass is the home loan debacle, and the decline in home prices. Following this has been our insatiable appetite for government money, especially when it is directed straight into our pockets. The downward shift in earning power is spreading wider, and we all know what's happened to the debt. Fasten your seat belts, folks, because now it's gonna start getting rough. Real rough.

6 votes

#1.6 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:02 AM EDT

AlexandraJolicoeur

Not to piss in your flowerpot or anything, but...

You say its bad, you are angry and afraid, yep afraid. I know because that is what I felt in the 60's, angry and afraid. You know what though, we used that anger and fear and we stepped up to the powers and said "NO MORE!". We took the reins of society and shook them with all of our might. We developed a counter culture that stepped away for what was being sold and we stood out in the streets and made our voices heard. We did not buy into the media who sold us Beaver Cleaver and Archie comics. We made our culture and music and politics into a rebellion of change.

All I could think of is, "and it's also your generation that has given my generation the host of issues and predicaments it faces". That being said, I completely agree with the sentiment that if you don't like what's happening, get out there and do something about it rather than complaining. I might get trounced for this on here, but back in 2009, I went to a tea party gathering in my state capitol; it was interesting, and it was not lost on me that the majority of the participants were Gen X'ers... go figure.

3 votes

#1.7 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:35 AM EDT

grumpy_jon

All I could think of is, "and it's also your generation that has given my generation the host of issues and predicaments it faces".

Alexandra, I presume from your statement that you are young (20's or 30's, at most?). The Dog and I felt the same way at that time in our lives. I was born in 1953, so I was very young in the 50's, young in the 60's and came of age in the very early 70's. So, I understand how you feel. The Hippies of the 60's turned into Yippies (please don't ask), then Yuppies (upwardly mobile professionals), then became born-again, neo-conservative, Republicans. This is fact for many, not all. Some never got beyond Hippie, stayed stoned and complaining.

The Dog's point, seemingly not lost on you, was to get out and get active. I would warn about those Gen X'ers that you mentioned, however, as they were largely responsible for giving your generation Iraq, which turned out to be your generation's version of Vietnam, which started the protest movement in the first place. The Tea Parties are largely run by people who still blame my generation for "losing" the Vietnam war. They were wrong; they are still wrong. Please don't get sucked into that negative way of thinking.

9 votes

#1.8 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:08 AM EDT

Rainbow Warrior

After the 60's & 70's too many of us Boomers became our parents. Rather than continuing the battle against "The Establishment" and maintaining "The Generation Gap" too many of us capitulated and became part of the problem rather than maintaining resistance and obtaining the changes we once demanded.

Think about it, we would run away from home and sleep in our cars back then rather than cut our hair and sign up for the draft. We had the balls to say you can't draft us at eighteen if we can't vote! We were not afraid to speak truth to power and expected to get beaten by the police.

All this talk about wanting to suck on the tit of the government, Bull @!$%#! The people sucking on the tit of government right now are the ones that need it least!!! Most of us just want what we have helped pay for ALL OF OUR LIVES! Don't @!$%#ing get me going about the consolidation of wealth and power by the few at the expense of the many because most of you reading this have become part of the problem and could care less if any solutions ever come about. You have more corporate dependencies and foul habits to be able to live how you think you should live than any drug addict, prostitute or bum I have ever met! If you continue to elect sociopaths who will steal ever penny you have and laugh all the way to the bank, you deserve it man.

We need another Wood Stock/Anti-Establishment type event to draw us all back together. We should burn down some corporate head quarters and put the fear of good old American retaliation back into the minds of the economic elite. We should take no lives, but attacking the symbols of wealth and power sure works... consider 9/11. When enough of us have nothing left to loose, I hope we can slide in side ways and say, "Wow, what a ride, we changed the World and determined the future".

The injustices and inequalities of the 50's were obvious and we did something about it during the 60's & 70's; civil rights, the draft, equal rights for women and allowing them to be in control of their own bodies, equal opportunity in employment and housing to name a few. Then for some reason we elected Ronald Reagan and went along with allowing things that were never the virtues of this country to be put in place in exchange; greed, vanity, exceptionalism (another term for I'm better than you and you should know it), legal bribery and graft to influence our representation at our own God Damn expense through special interests and K Street!

And now we are faced with fighting all these battles again. Why?

My simple explanation is the consolidation of wealth and power by the few at the expense of the many... our age old human condition that we seem to have re-address generation after generation after @!$%#ing generation.

9 votes

#1.9 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:51 AM EDT

maxmillion

Yep it was bad in the 60's but low a behold bit by bit Democrats lost their grip and school became accesible to blacks...Democrats no longer won their elections for Governor with the"klan vote" but you think things are bad???? today???...yep!...they still are...when lefty is still quoting the word of the"Klan" to get their message across...it is still bad.

Ku Klux Klan Distances Selves From Westboro Baptist Church, Tea Party
article source from Wokette

let the censorship begin!

2 votes

#1.10 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:43 PM EDT

WTF are you taking re-reg? pass that over and take a deep breath to let some air get back in that cranium.

4 votes

#1.11 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:23 PM EDT

Max Do us all a favor: tune in, turn on, and drop out.

5 votes

#1.12 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:24 PM EDT

maxmillion

and the censorship begins....

#1.13 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:29 PM EDT

Your comment is still up there, no censorship at all, you want me to delete you so you can prove your right about something. Go troll a weinergate story till you are kicked off the vine dude.

and the troll said "censor me" and the dog says "HA HA make me".

6 votes

#1.14 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:36 PM EDT

only in your head there Max (LOL, maxheadroom)

This old hippie knows we have more freedom of speech now that we ever did. Yelling "@!$%# you" at a cop could get you arrested back in the day.

We get by with everything now, nothing is off limits.

4 votes

#1.15 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:47 PM EDT

Citizen Kane-473667

Not True. Verbal Abuse of an Officer is an arrestable crime. You may beat the charge-but you won't beat the ride!

5 votes

#1.16 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:01 PM EDT

Verbal Abuse of an Officer is an arrestable crime.

Thanks Kane! I will watch my tongue then (He he)

3 votes

#1.17 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:10 PM EDT

GREG - STL

Verbal Abuse of an Officer is an arrestable crime.

I learned this one the hard way. The cops didnt arrest me though, just busted up my lip and eye. There was one cop in particular who had it in for me, even though ive never been arrested or in serious trouble with the law. Inner city police don't really play if they know youre from the area, because what you going to do, it's your word against the pigs.

#1.18 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:32 PM EDT

rescue dogs62

Thanks for the invite Vlad. Not nearly as a delightful subject as famous quotes with Sarah, where I had a great time, but more important. I, too "grew up" during the 50's early 60's. Grew up back East with segregation, and all the ugliness that goes with it, and also remember the union scabs. Things are ugly today, also those of us who got angry during Viet Nam, and Martin Luther King days see that same type of us against them. However, I don't think we"re supposed to be the "me" generation, I think it's the one who came after....you know, like our kids, and theirs. Definitely a "me" generation. All those kids that it was so important to build their self-esteem. I think some have it, but with it came a sense of entitlement that isn't always deserved. I'm probably way off subject, and I think I just broke you're first post, so feel free to delete this.

Smiles, good subject. RD

12 votes

#2 - Tue May 31, 2011 6:50 PM EDT

My Dad was born in 1940. He was a bigger fan of The Kingston Trio than The Who. My parents were out of college and remained conservative while others were taking off their bras and practicing "free love." I'm glad for the change in regards to equal rights and the war but other than that.....I'm not sure of what awesome, great change the hippies brought to our country. My friends parents were all younger than mine and matched many dime bags when I was at their house. I've got a bit of hippie in me because I was born in 1973 but I see a lot of negatives that came out of that movement which is a BIG reason why future generations have been so lost.

8 votes

#3 - Tue May 31, 2011 6:50 PM EDT

As an "aging hippie" I can agree with you that there was a downside to the 60's. Along with the folks who were really fighting to right the wrongs were those who were just along for the ride and took advantage of the drugs and the "free love".

But we found out that "free love" was not really free in the end. And some kids really messed themselves up with the drugs.

Now, the music of the 60's was great.

Not everything we did was good, but boy was it fun!

9 votes

#3.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:24 AM EDT

to see what impact we had in the 60's you have to step back a little. We challenged the status quo, we demanded that everyone be treated equally and we wanted the people in charge to recognize us as a force to be reckoned with. Our sit ins and protests were a shock to the establishment, hell Nixon wanted to label us public enemy #1.

What we did was get their attention and when it was obvious we were making headway, most of us went home, got married, had children and still fought for the rights of all Americans.

I would march again and I would stand up with my fellow seniors and juniors and show "the man" that we are still here and we still have a unified voice. I still believe that change is possible and I believe we can make a difference. I would march against Wall Street or against DC, both need to be put on notice that we will not take anymore of their stupid @!$%#.

Excellent post Vlad....why aren't you my friend :-)

9 votes

#3.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:19 AM EDT

G. H.

Good one Vlad's! I would go out again to open some eyes! My old joke is: "I have a cane and I know how to use it"! (which really is true!) LOL Passive doesn't get it! All those who just sit inside and complain deserve everything they get.......................get off your hinies and VOTE at least!

6 votes

#3.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:15 PM EDT

Candide and Me

It is different this time. We common Americans have been had. The system has taken the honey from our hive and there is no one or place to go for a redo. No one to protest against. We can vent and fight amongst ourselves but it will avail not. The kisses have been taken and only the foil remains.

Our social security has been taken and spent. We are facing unprecedented deficits, national debt, continuous trade deficits, decline $, exploding medicare/caid cost, high unemployment, or homes are now only houses with little worth, a need for an increased dept ceiling, our jobs have moved out of our borders, and for some unknown reason the stock market marches higher??? It will not get better within the boomers remaining days.

So yell, scream, raise your fist and be mad as hell but much better would be to spend your time creating a new America for your future. You should organize, plan, retool, rethink, redo, rewrite, recreate the America you want for your future. Do it for you because every other generation has done it for them and that is why you find yourself in this situation. The Me generation started in the Garden.

10 votes

#4 - Tue May 31, 2011 8:31 PM EDT

We are stardust, we are golden...So much positive energy that has been destroyed in the "Culture Wars." We get blamed for everything now, including the Priests who did bad things-did you see that?

Always darkest just before the dawn though dog. We gotta "keep the faith" (remember that one??? such a different context now!!!) that this new generation will look beyond materialism, as we did (for a time, until me came along), and lead us to where it's at-universal love, baby! We just have to be listening, and encourage them like you're doing now. I have two teenage sons, and they just blow me away. What else you gonna do?

6 votes

#5 - Tue May 31, 2011 9:36 PM EDT

Wasn't all that "positive energy" a total free for all though? If it feels good then it MUST be good? I don't think the 60's are to blame for any wrong doing the Priests have done but I do think the 60's played a big part in the break down of the traditional family. Commitment was lost by many. I mean.....marriage doesn't always feel good and isn't always fun.

That is the main reason I think the 60's generation is referred to as the "me" generation. The husband or wife was thinking about their own happiness and well being but severely damaged their children in the process. I'm sorry to feel the need to say this and hope I don't offend too many but divorce is 9 times out of 10 a selfish act.

5 votes

#5.1 - Tue May 31, 2011 9:46 PM EDT

Thank you Becky for your thoughtful comments. There was so much repressed emotion in the '50's-women were there to make sure Dad had a drink and the newspaper handed to him when he walked in the door. Mom was all dolled up, and the kids, well, they were to be bright and shiny, say hello, and then be whisked away by Mom. Well, the Pill came along, women's lib, the war, and a new economy that required two incomes. There were civil rights riots, riots on campus...a complete rejection of materialism and the mess our parents had gotten us into. Nobody's fault really, but that repression was uncorked, and we just exploded, not knowing any better, being young and enthusiastic. Couldn't be helped! '60's were the "Woodstock" generation. Then, the overreation-the me generation of the mid-late 70's-materialism, and disco...It was over. Evaporated! Just like that! As soon as the war was over, really.

Although their was plenty of hedonism going around at the time, I can say that because of what happened then, we have a lot more individual freedom today, and we are more broad minded as a country. Look around-our President is Black! Women in powerful positions, able to express themselves openly. Gay rights-they have their contribution to make, and we need them to make it! Oh, and no Draft! 18 year-olds can vote! You get the idea. This is progress, and it can't be stopped-not by me, or you, or anyone. So, YOU have to get out in front of it, and take the lead. With freedom comes responsibility, and your generation has the most freedom of any before you. Use it as wisely as you can-the moment goes fast!

The divorce thing-yeah, that's a bummer. Something like 6 out of ten marriages have cheaters. Teenage pregnancy too...some people can't handle the responsibility of all that freedom, I guess. But don't let that make you miss the good. And remember, the cream rises to the top.

I think you are very sincere, and smart. Keep asking us questions, and we'll do whatever we can for you! But it really has to come from you. Go get 'em.

13 votes

#5.2 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:51 PM EDT

You're awesome Artie! I'll go get em' next year (if we're all still here) lol I just had a double mastectomy and am having a hysterectomy next month. I'm laughing right now.....sorta.

You're so right...the freedoms we have now are because of you all. I do admire you all coming together as you did. So true, some can't handle the responsibility and thus, the bad rep. Doesn't that go with just everything. One bad apple spoils the bunch and people do tend to remember more bad than good. Apparently, I was one of them. :) Peace!

7 votes

#5.3 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:26 PM EDT

genevieveva

Well said and a great topic. I remember we use to have sit-downs in high school over local and national issues. Our small town had one sewage plant and they were dumping raw sewage directly into our river. We forced them to clean up their company. We peacefully took on climate change, dress code, war, race issues, etc. I am not saying we were not afraid but as a group, it was exciting and fun at times. As a group, we got so much done but it took time. The news was not corporate information being piped through cable TV or talk radio. It is amazing how large groups can work together to force change. Change is what we need now and one man can not make it happen; WE have too make it happen. Large peaceful protests is the way to force change on a large scale.

We need to encourage our children to get involved. Below is one safe group for children and parents alike to support for those interested. Decide for your self. It was started by a 17 yr. old young man.

http://imattermarch.org

4 votes

#5.4 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:15 AM EDT

Artie and genevieveva-

I can relate to your posts 100%!

The 50's was not the idyllic time the media portrays it to be.

My generation wasn't perfect, but boy did we blow the lid off of the stuffy, hypocritical 50"s!!

7 votes

#5.5 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:30 AM EDT

A sleeping bag a tent and a bag of dope, the good old days.

10 votes

#6 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:01 PM EDT

..and a VW van!

7 votes

#6.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:30 AM EDT

Given the way things have turned out, we probably should have stayed with it!

6 votes

#6.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:05 AM EDT

Amen!

5 votes

#6.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:45 AM EDT

genevieveva

Maybe we should teach children how to get involved. Recently I was impressed by a group that was created by a seventeen yr old boy. Please visit the site. It may give us hope. It has rapidly grown and I believe adults should support it too.

http://imattermarch.org

1 vote

#6.4 - Thu Jun 9, 2011 11:51 PM EDT

Wow - you mean Leave It to Beaver was ... a lie?? Ok...

And yet I am old enough to remember the 50s. We collectively had an unthinking reflexive ideology of America is Good - I'm not disparaging patriotism and I admire it, but I think it's better when it's based on something that's actually going on and that's really not what we did back then. The 60s were almost necessary to take the teflon off that and make being an American real.

Oh and the 50s as traditional family? Wife beating was encouraged to keep the woman in her place - and back alley abortions - and men had to be all formal and kiss up to upper management in a way you never ever see today. No thanks!!

10 votes

#7 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:24 PM EDT

I have to agree with you on that one Mark. I don't know what happened from the 40's to the 50's. My grandfather was in the room when my mother was born in 1940 but wasn't allowed when my Aunt was born 10 years later. It seems like people got very plastic and fake in the 50's. The 50's did cause the severe rebellion of the 60's. Maybe the 50's are to blame? lol Oh....who am I kidding.....every generation is faulty....including mine. :)

9 votes

#7.1 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:42 PM EDT

Yeah the 50s was major plasticky and fake. Lucy and Desi slept in separate beds? Seriously??

Growing up in the 50s and into the early 60s our parents would make us clean up the house for days and cook the best dinner and bring out the best dishes if the "boss" or the local pastor came to visit or anyone that was a supposedly higher social strata than us and we'd have the *** beat out of us if we weren't on our best behavior. We all collectively observed that and threw it out as the 60s progressed we weren't doing that for anybody!! I do have a lot of admiration for how good my parents and that generation are at "entertaining" we don't have that panache any more, but to me to get out from that utterly fake demeaning stupid kowtowing was worth losing the art.

10 votes

#7.2 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:51 PM EDT

utterly fake demeaning stupid kowtowing was worth losing the art.

Agreed. My grandparent DID have twin beds on my father's side!!!! lol My mother-in-law has a book from home economics (that only the girls took) It talked about putting yourself together before the husband gets home from work and making sure the kids and house are in order. You know....he's had a stressful day at work and needs to come home and relax. The dudes had it GOOD in the 50's! lol

8 votes

#7.3 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:31 PM EDT

Wow could you imagine mandating home economics for girls and shop for boys the way they did it back then?

Yes women had it worse than men but I'd say it wasn't that great for men either who had to put up this weird superficial macho posture to each other and the world you don't have to do now. "Comportment" was a major part of any man's life back then and the parameters were very very narrow.

9 votes

#7.4 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:35 PM EDT

That's true, the men had a lot of weight on their shoulders.

7 votes

#7.5 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:42 PM EDT

The roles were too defined and confining. A lot of women got married, moved to the suburbs, had a bunch of children, and slowly went mad.

8 votes

#7.6 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:34 AM EDT

Its interesting that this very thing you describe is what the christian fundamentalists currently aspire to, the leave it to beaver patriarchal society.

6 votes

#7.7 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:08 AM EDT

featheredserpent - yeah it's a definite impulse for the fundamentalist right to drive us back into the past. They think they can do it and only recover the good parts which seems awful crazy to me.

3 votes

#7.8 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:57 PM EDT

Yeah, the whole thing is a huge bag of crazy!

2 votes

#7.9 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:05 PM EDT

G. H.

My great grandparents not only had separate beds, they had separate ROOMS! With large families too, however many kids fit in the bathtub or the bed was all that mattered. No laws saying boys and girls had to have separate everything, except *stereotypes*. I don't know if this part is really true or not, but it SEEMS like we didn't have as many perverts running around loose. Yes, I HAD to take Home Ec., no boys allowed............LOL. In fact in Catholic School, the boys were in one classroom and the girls were in another. What a generation of Contradictions!

3 votes

#7.10 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:36 PM EDT

G.H. there were plenty of perverts running around loose back then. One thing that amazes me today is I know some guys who went to a Catholic school with priests they *knew* were trying to fool around with the boys. The older boys generally protected the younger ones from them and they all knew who to watch out for. The whole aura around being a priest was so powerful no one actually called them on it or tried to get these evil bastards out.

3 votes

#7.11 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:07 PM EDT

Marshall James

vlad

you are right the people need to take it back.

and that is why we need to bring individualism back.

Ron Paul 2012

5 votes

#8 - Tue May 31, 2011 10:41 PM EDT

James I like the individualism, for sure, but RP? 1/2 the stuff I really like, but the other stuff is out there-no offense, but to take a position dogmatically and not allow for the big picture sometimes...not so sure. I like the newness-it's definitely refreshing change.

4 votes

#8.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:56 AM EDT

voxrationis

For aging hippy types the Tea Party is hardly the solution. Half of the things we achieved (Civil Rights, Voting Rights, Women's Rights) they want to undo. And nevermind that the vast majority of Tea Partiers are literalist Christians. An attribute we free thinkers disdain. And frankly the bigotry and racism I encountered upon meeting my first TP's soured me permanently on this entity. Sorry but if this is what your Third Party looks like, keep it.

Most of us now know that government does have a legitimate role in our lives. We don't want it to be overly intrusive but we don't want it dissolved either. We understand that private industry needs a watchdog. We know why the '08 economic collapse occured and we know it had very little to do with government.

We saw a glimpse of anarchy in the late 60's and it wasn't exactly our cup of tea either.

9 votes

#8.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:14 AM EDT

Great perspective Vox. Nothing I would disagree with.

7 votes

#8.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:37 AM EDT

Becky: I see now you were born in 1973. I was about 20 years off in what I was thinking. Please forgive.

5 votes

#9 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:09 PM EDT

Forgive you for what? Do I not belong here because I am 20 years younger than you thought? I'm learning from you all and even though I didn't experience the 60's....I am one of the products of it! lmao

6 votes

#9.1 - Tue May 31, 2011 11:34 PM EDT

Wait a minute Artie....you thought I was 20 years younger! I thought you mistook me for 57 and not 17. I'm 37. bhahahahhahaha!!!!!

I still have a lot to learn but I certainly wasn't this bright 20 years ago! lol

7 votes

#9.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:54 AM EDT

Yeah, u'r on to me. I said you were smart!!! U've got a winning attitude. Thanks for writing, and sharing. You are very courageous.

Let me please tell you something back about me. I'm 56, and graduated from HS in '72 when I was 17. I had a high number, and the war was winding down. I was lucky, coming into it all when I did, because I had the very best of those times, without the scaring, although I was rebellious, and I have some regrets...people I must have hurt who loved me, and I didn't really understand. Youthful folly I guess. I've come to the conclusion that I've spent half my life trying to get to somewhere where I thought I should be, and then I spend the second half, trying to claw my way back. But it's too late, and I can't go back. You inspired me, however, and for a brief moment in time, I went back. Thank you for that.

5 votes

#9.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:31 AM EDT

I appoligize for being so vocal on this one but my thoughts are racing. :)

Because of my age, and having older parents. I still experienced the influences of the 60's generation and so did my husband. He was born in 69 WHOOOHOOO!!!! We all know what was going on then! I have to say.....I do wish I could have experienced that. Something about just letting go. :) Being completely real with everyone.

When I was growning up. All my friend's parents were getting a divorce. I was so afraid and insecure that my parents were going to jump on that wagon. Every time they'd argue, I'd ask if they were going to get divorced and wondered what my life would be like. It was so scary to me. As I grew up, I saw how unhappy my parents were at times but admired their commitment. They suffered at times for us but then that made me feel selfish. I thought my friends with divorced parents had turned out to be well rounded adults. So I thought.

My husband and I struggled in our marriage when my mother was very ill for a long time and then died. I resented him and he didn't understand why I felt so burdened to care for her and neglect our first child at times. I felt like it was the last time I could do right by her. She'd be gone soon and our daughter will still be here. She was only 18 months. We divorced after our second child because we couldn't stop the fighting. We never stopped loving each other though. I thought I was happier divorced for a while but I wasn't. I loved that there wasn't any fighting. It tore me up seeing what it did to my children. I was taking the easy road for myself and forcing my children to live in insecurity and fear without any choice. We dated......long story short.....he knocked me up with our third child and we reconciled. The fighting is less as we're maturing. A MUCH healthier home. We've been back together a 1 1/2.

The point I'm trying to make is, my divorced friends from divorced parents are not reconciled. They aren't burdened by what they're doing to their children. I think that's some of the damage the 60's did to their kids. Fortunately, I had influences from parents born in the 40's and depression Grandparents.

I think this is the longest post I've ever written. Sorry if I've bored you....I can't help myself :)

6 votes

#9.4 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:59 AM EDT

Wow, thank you for that Becky, and that was not boring at all! I'm moved by it.

And yes, the letting go, and being completely real-it was a very innocent time in a way. People getting back to the land, and living in communes, the great literature, artwork, and of course, the music. Hmmm, I think I left something off...can't remember :) Anyway, it couldn't last forever-the way had come to an end.

Your personal story is very compelling. Marriage, kids, sick and dying parent, divorce, your own health, work, finances, reconcile, another child...but it sounds like you two are working through the process. You have not abandoned your conscience, like the others, because you know you couldn't bear it. Sometimes you maybe wish you could just walk away from it, but you've earned that conscience, and you can find fulfillment, at least now and then! Those others can't at all. You have a hope, and your successes will slowly build. You definitely have your hands full for a while longer. Hope I'm not out of line with this!

As for me, I first married at 32, to a Texas beauty. It was four years of houseplay fun, no kids. When she realized I wasn't going to buy her an oil well after all, well, that was about it. I came back to CA for geology graduate school, and married a classmate, my soulmate, 18 years ago. I had my first child at 43. I'm glad I waited, but with two boys, one autistic, I'm worn out! Wife works full time too. Kids are older now, so things are much easier. Autistic son is going to be fine, after all. It's been the most difficult, and the most rewarding experience I've had in my life.

Mother sick & dying over a ten year period-in hospice now. My Dad, 79, is healthy, and I so love him now. They divorced when I was 22, and I was accepting at the time. Then angry with him about the cheating, then angry w/Mom-such a Pill! Divorce was harder on her than me. I don't know why I'm telling you this-hope you don't mind. I wish the very best for you.

5 votes

#9.5 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:25 AM EDT

Thank you also for sharing Artie. I too wish you all the best. You absolutely were NOT out of line...I appreciate all that you've said.

I think back on how I was as a child. How I saw other people and how I felt inside. Now a days, I frequently find myself fighting back tears of sadness at the reality of just how cruel our world is and how we treat each other. I hold on to the hope that God is making me a stronger person for a reason. I am definitely NOT that little girl anymore. We can't understand certain experiences and emotions until we've been through it. When ever I'd whine when I was sick my mother would say, "Well....if you were never sick then you wouldn't appreciate the times that you feel good." There's so much superficial vanity today. If you ain't got the dough....you ain't somebody. So many of us (myself included) are finding ourselves having to do without like never before. I grew up pour so that kind of sacrifice doesn't bother me as much and doesn't define me. The other things though....have been more difficult.

Let's do take something that we've learned from the 60's. The 60's was about getting one with nature and appreciating basic things. Not valuing ourselves on our possessions and loving and accepting ALL people....just as they are. :) That's something I'm ready to start doing today!

5 votes

#9.6 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:26 PM EDT

Great idea Becky, value people not possesions. See you do have a little 60's in you. :)

5 votes

#9.7 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:31 PM EDT

I already admitted Vlad that I have a bit of hippie in me. I am NOT ashamed!!!! lolololol :)

5 votes

#9.8 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:52 PM EDT

Becky Your Mother gave you good advice. Some call it having/not having a "frame of reference," based on having/not having an experience.

I can't say to you about god, but I can say, follow your conscience and you will find fulfillment and strength accordingly. To abandon it is to throw away your connection to others, as well as your self. No need for that, now is there? Just makes things worse anyway. You are courageous, and it won't always be difficult. Maintain yourself, and you will attract others who share your philosophy and principles...like us :)

You're exactly right about nature. Find peace and quiet in it, with it. I studied it, I love it so much. Sounds like youare on your way back to rediscovering it, and all the wonderousness of life. Hardest part is to start :)

3 votes

#9.9 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:07 PM EDT

That's why I can only claim a bit of hippie because I do believe in Jesus. I've gotten used to being a bit of an outsider because I look at Jesus as a hippie (minus the weed and hallucinogenic drugs) and try to follow that. One of the most common phases in my household growing up was, "What would Jesus do?" That's not the common Christian philosophy we see today. It's the 70's Christian man! I know the difference between Ministry and Missionry. Many Christians don't.

I have more friends that are non-Christain hippies than I do conservative Christians. The only thing we don't share is our faith. Everything else, we do. A lot of Christians don't think I'm a true believer. I don't care though....only God knows my heart.

I am finding some peace. I need to get back on my feet and join the Peace Core I think or just move to Ecuador. The kids would LOVE it! lol

1 vote

#9.10 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:42 PM EDT

Many hippies were Jesus freaks. They believed they should live as Jesus taught. They placed more emphasis on the Good Semaritan than on Paul. They believed in deeds.

4 votes

#9.11 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:56 PM EDT

Many hippies were Jesus freaks

Awesome!!!! lol Maybe there is a group where I belong!

2 votes

#9.12 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:13 PM EDT

samenslow I believe hippies are over-romanticized I remember them as arrogant, extremely life-stupid, pampered and shallow. I used to joke I couldn't afford to be a hippie. They didn't do a whole hell of a lot to help anyone but themselves.

I remember a lot of the hippie acid-heads in the early 70s got religion for a while and turned their overblown naive arrogance toward that then after they got burned out and a little grounded they gave that up too.

2 votes

#9.13 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:04 PM EDT

That's true there is that bunch but they're not exclusive to hippie Jesus freaks. There are a lot of zealots that are looking for the "religious high". They stand on their own mountain top and fall HARD off the cliff.

1 vote

#9.14 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:53 PM EDT

AlKhidr

Ah the 50s. Nothing like having a childhood nightmare that a mushroom cloud has just incinerated your hometown. And as for Catholic priests, the one in my hometown was fondling the altar boys in the 50s, not the 60s, the decade the Vatican claims pop culture corrupted the clergy's medieval minds. And then as I outgrew the 1950s along with the nation, I recall the nagging fear beginning in middle school that I would be drafted and sent to Vietnam, otherwise known as the "meat grinder."

What has changed since the 1950s? First off, the realization that we are more likely to go out with a wimper than a bang. Second, at least now kids have adults they can turn to who don't fall down at the feet of the Catholic priest. Third, the end to the draft, so that if somebody wants to travel to faraway lands, meet exotic people, and then kill them, it's a matter of personal choice to express your patriotism thusly.

11 votes

#10 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:51 AM EDT

so that if somebody wants to travel to faraway lands, meet exotic people, and then kill them, it's a matter of personal choice to express your patriotism thusly.

OK....I LOVED your entire post but the above was my favorite!!!!!!!!!!lol

7 votes

#10.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:11 AM EDT

Yeah, u'r on to me. I said you were smart!!! U've got a winning attitude. Thanks for writing, and sharing. You are very courageous.

Thank you thank you Artie. I'm holding on to those complements :) FR sent

3 votes

#11 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:20 AM EDT

U'R welcome Becky, but it's nothin' but the truth :) FR accepted

Wow-how did it get so late?

2 votes

#12 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:35 AM EDT

Becky (9.2) That's a Sponge Bob laugh, right, or am I embarrassing the whole NV? Both? I know, don't flatter myself...bhahahahhahaha!!!!!

Oh...look at the time! Geemennee! (Cricket!) (He's cooltoo.) What-am-I-thinking?

1 vote

#13 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:03 AM EDT

I didn't know that was the Sponge Bob laugh but you're right....it is! Unfortunately, my laugh is similar. People seem to find it amusing though. lmao

1 vote

#13.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:50 PM EDT

The 50's were reflected in films like The Man in the Grey Fannel Suit, A Gentleman's Agreement, and others. Conformity was the rule (WASP conformity). TV documentaries told us about Hunger in America, Harvest of Shame, Silent Spring. Perhaps the spirit of the 50's is best illustrated by the film Pleasantville. America could be a wonderful place if "You are all white in America." There were few who had a different vision of what was happening in America, but, like Lenny Bruce, they were hounded by the enforcers for the status quo.

In the 60's we changed and were educated (mostly to fight communism to question). Kennedy told us there were problems out there but we could meet all challenges. Religion, lead not only by the likes of Martin Luther King but also by John XXIII, focused on uplifting people's lives. Liberation theology encouraged us to help the poor be poor no more. Churches and Synagogues sponsored students who ventured South to fight racial inequality (more tha a few were killed), others helped migrate workers organize to gain economic and political power. We wanted our future to be more than, "Plastics". This could be a better world, and we wanted to help shape it.

Dylan was the poet of our generation with "The Times They Are A Changing" and "Like a Rolling Stone" Our parents were freaked, "Something is happening here but you do not know what it is. Do you, Mr. Jones." Peyton Place showed the hypocracy of the 50's, and every small town was angry at its author for writing about their hometown. The Rolling Stones sang of "Momma's Little Helper" (valium). Harper Lee showed both the beauty and ugliness of the South in Kill a Mockingbird and James Baldwin penned Giovanni's Room, Another Country, and The Fire Next Time. We questioned and challenged not because we hated America but because we loved America and wanted it to live up to its ideals and promise. We wanted us to live those American values we bragged about. American values were not just political slogans but real things to be protected in reality. There wa more to life than the name sticked on the ass of your jeans or the name of the car you drove or the length of your Hair.

There is something sad about meeting 22 year olds worried about their 401K plans or who favor the virtual world over the real world.

6 votes

#14 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:01 AM EDT

Sorry, but my editing and spell check vanished.

#14.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:09 AM EDT

Your post was wonderful! Couldn't have said it better!

#14.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:37 AM EDT

AlKhidr

There was also something sad about hearing that Dylan was welcomed to go to China to play his songs as long as he avoided certain revolutionary songs (since I guess China is no longer in the "revolutionary" mood). Yeah, the times they never stopped a changin'.

4 votes

#14.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:54 AM EDT

What happened to all of those Americans ,with all of those revolutionary ideas and ideals? Did they all turn into servile, apathetic, self absorbed pawns being prodded along by a bunch of corporate fascists??

1 vote

#14.4 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:19 AM EDT

Most of them are now insurance salesmen.

LOL

3 votes

#14.5 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:46 AM EDT

Nixon, Reagan and the current head of FOX news helped create the Silent majority, formed alliances with the Moral majority, and told us that if we thought America did anything wrong that needed to be corrected, we hated America and our traditional values. After all, it was "Morning in America".

Disco.

#14.6 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:53 AM EDT

What happened to all of those Americans ,with all of those revolutionary ideas and ideals?

A lot of the same "idealists" from those days are Tea Partiers now. I wrote a NV article asking, "What happened?" and learned from the replies that the motivator for many people to protest against the war was the same as it is for their current political stance, selfishness.

In the 60s many were against the Vietnam War, not because of a sense of morality, but of mortality. They didn't want to go, to risk getting killed. I don't blame them but feel that it is important to understand that it wasn't all a golden age of righteous action.

#14.7 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:42 PM EDT

Many protesting the war went to jail or were forced to give up their futures by going to Canada. They were not cowards seeking self preservation. Later many Viet-nam vets supported them. Those who avoided the draft or fled the country remembered the lessons of the Nuremberg War Trails where "Just following orders" was shown not to be an excuse for abandoning your own morality or responsibilities.

T-Party and Libertarians are about "protecting me and mine" and to Hell with everyone else.

1 vote

#14.8 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:02 PM EDT

I'm not saying you are wrong and I never said they were cowards. I'm just reporting what several people told me were their own motives or those of many of the people around them. "Protecting me" definitely came into it for the responders. It was hardly a scientific study and obviously the impression I got could have been skewed based on who chose to reply. Another large group expressed the opinion that, "we got old and changed our minds" when asked what happened to their idealism.

I don't know what I would have done. I was against the war but being pretty young, I doubt if I could have articulated why exactly. The draft ended the year I turned 13.

1 vote

#14.9 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:48 PM EDT

samenslow Didn't Jimmy Carter pardon them, those who went to Canada, and get a lot of flack for that? Jail was 5 years. Some became conscientious objectors, and served as writers and such, for 2 years, I guess, not 4. I had a high number, and it was at the end of the war; otherwise, I might have left (No deferment possible). "What if they gave a war, and nobody came." It was a horrible time, in these respects.

2 votes

#14.10 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 3:01 PM EDT

"What if they gave a war, and nobody came." It was a horrible time, in these respects.

oh god it was an awful war, lost 2 classmates in one day. 50,000 plus...for what??

I marched hard to bring home the troops and I was NEVER disrespectful to them in any way. Took a woman out (knocked her down and bloodied her nose) for calling them baby killers. *shudder* I hope we never see times like that again.

I pray our boys all come home soon. "it's time we watch children what's that sound everybody look what's goin' down".

7 votes

#14.11 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:32 PM EDT

Jimmy Carter did pardon them and was a true pacifist which was why he was so strongly disliked in government. People didn't like being told what their personal moral code should be by their president and the politicians thought he was weak. I think he was one of the very very few who didn't play their ugly game and unfortunately he wasn't very graceful with his words when addressing the public.

Correct me if I'm wrong on that. I LOVE Jimmy Carter for the man that he is and always has been true to. Carter and Truman....my favs. :)

3 votes

#14.12 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:06 PM EDT

Carter and Truman....my favs. :)

yes, me too. Truman was president when I was born. I liked Ike too! He was a man you could really respect!

Carter got a bum deal all the way around. He is a good man.

I've enjoyed reading your posts and Artie's too! FR sent to you both. Becky you are the same age as my youngest.

3 votes

#14.13 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:15 PM EDT

Ditto CCArm and thank you. I forgot about Ike. He was a remarkable man too. Truman had on his desk, "The Buck Stops Here" That man took full ownership and did many remarkable things for the working man.

This is one of the best threads I've participated in in a long time. Where did all you wonderful people come from? I've missed most of you till now. I'm lovin' it! FR accepted.

2 votes

#14.14 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:25 PM EDT

looks like our friend Artie is brand new sprout! Welcome to the vine Artie!

3 votes

#14.15 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:37 PM EDT

Yes.....welcome!

1 vote

#14.16 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:53 PM EDT

Thanks Becky...said you were smart! Carter also made peace between Israel and Egypt. He tried to cancell US participation in the Olympic Games when the Soviets invaded Afghanistan, 1980(?), but can't remember if that went through. Tried to get us to change our energy policy...ahemm. Had tough luck on the economy though (17% interest rates), and with the Iranian Hostage Crisis, the thing w/Kennedy at the convention-in comes "Ronald RayGuns-Zap!" That was Woodstock-JB, right?

Truman, good choice. He steadied the country after Roosevelt's death, dropped the bomb on Japan, fired MacArthur, got us in and out of Korea without WWIII happening. Another horrible time too, that we haven't talked about. Wasn't it 38 thousand GI's lost in 2 years? Staggering...it was UN, and undeclared, I think(?). Never signed a peace treaty either...just an armistice.

OK...Somebody want to do Ike?

Oh, sorry guys-I was out!

2 votes

#14.17 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:09 PM EDT

Thank you CCArm-Becky-v. much. Brand new sprout I am, fresh out of the GH, and v glad to be here! FR's :) I'm one lucky guy!

3 votes

#14.18 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:23 PM EDT

Hey Artie, glad to met a new viner. Welcome and have fun. :)

3 votes

#14.19 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:29 PM EDT

Thanks, uhm, dog. I'm very happy to be here, and this is fun!

I'm a dog person myself :)

2 votes

#14.20 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:46 PM EDT

I should know more about Ike Artie. I can't tell you how many field trips I took to his museum growing up. lol......guess what State I'm in! :)

Forgot to tell ya' I too married a Texan and his Dad has oil wells! Hubby is working for his Dad now but he's salary.....more will come later as long as they keep pumpin'

1 vote

#14.21 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:52 PM EDT

My medical bills are killing us, have 3 kids and I can't work for a while. I was fired from my job because it was a sales job that my boss didn't think I could do due to my surgeries. Unemployment is disputing my benefits because they think I can't physically work. I can push paper and am looking for work. I've had a couple offers but they don't want me to come on board until I'm through which won't be for two more months. Cobra insurance is OUTRAGEOUS so needless to say....we're feeling the financial crunch.

Money makes life easier but it doesn't make you happy. We're finding it. I pray that the others that are suffering too are finding it as well.

2 votes

#14.22 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:34 PM EDT

I was wondering about that. Health costs are a huge expense in this country, and I know about COBRA-ouch. My wife works for the County. Insurance is still quite expensive, but covers the cost of our son's therapies and aids. My Mom was on Medicare, now Medicaid, since she spent out. Nursing home is 6K/mo. Expensive to get sick or get injured or get old.

2 votes

#14.23 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:45 PM EDT

I marched to bring home the troops also but I never dis-respected our soldiers. Thank God we have learned our lesson in that respect.

"Give 'em Hell" Harry Truman was a great and learned man and a great president. I have been to his home in MO and his "Little White House" in Key West. As simple as he appeared, he was a historian and had more common sense than anyone since.

He once said "I don't give 'em hell; I tell them the truth and they think it's hell."

Touche.

5 votes

#14.24 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:47 AM EDT

Luther28

I also grew up during the fifties and sixties in what was once the largest textile manufacturing city in the world, which since the seventies has been an economic wasteland (jobs shipped overseas). Although I do not remember the times as desperate as Vlad (certain regions were worse than others) we certainly did not have the things (or junk) that are available today but we did have the same foundations for upheaval and unrest and as Vlad states we did something about it. If you want to change the world it will need your help, it will not change on it's own you must be the spark.

3 votes

#15 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:33 AM EDT

acravatt

Fifties? We're looking at a return to the twenties or thirties. Everyone here is following the Amish like they were the Grateful Dead, learning how to farm again.

1 vote

#16 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:33 AM EDT

Maybe they're following the Amish because they're realizing that the Amish get something that the rest of the world doesn't. lol I still want my MTV though! lololol

3 votes

#16.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:36 PM EDT

I've always been thankful that I missed the fifties (and most of the sixties) entirely. It seems if you were an adult, white Christian male, things were okay. All other people though....Hell on earth...

4 votes

#17 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:34 AM EDT

Even white, Christian males didn't have it all that good...

2 votes

#17.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:38 AM EDT

Beautiful samenslow. I got a little misty-eyed.

I'd forgotten about the "jesus freaks," which was not a put down thing to say-on the contrary. "Lotta freaks!" Just one more joining in. It was great for me, being in at the tail end-Thanks.

(clicked the wrong reply button-that's why I'm down here. sorry about that!)

2 votes

#17.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:49 AM EDT

Thanks. "Freak" was a compliment.

"We are the people our parents warned us about."

Really freaked them out with, "White boys are so pretty....." and "Chocolate flavored love."

We also laughed at ourselves.

3 votes

#17.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:58 AM EDT

When I hear the word "freak" I think of R. Crumb.

Keep on Truckin' and Mr. Natural.

3 votes

#17.4 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:49 AM EDT

1devon,

Things weren't ok. WASPs are ok and everyone else suffered? You did indeed miss something.

2 votes

#17.5 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 1:49 PM EDT

Well as I said, I missed it all. Wasn't born yet. I have a hard time believing that 'white christian adult males' didn't have it much better than every minority in the country. Not from everything I've been told and read.

2 votes

#17.6 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 9:51 AM EDT

It's mostly true, but my parents' experience was that poor whites got crapped on then, as now. A lot of people refused to believe poor whites existed. I wasn't there so I don't know if it was as bad as for other races or not.

1 vote

#17.7 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:02 AM EDT

I wouldn't doubt there were poor whites. Not at all. But given that racism was so accepted, I'd think they still had it better than poor minorities.

2 votes

#17.8 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:04 AM EDT

Yes, there were poor white trash, trailer park white trash, white trash subsistence farmers, white trash garbage men and women, white trash sewer workers, white trash junkies and so on. No matter how poor, thieving, and uneducated they were they were not better off because they were white. Unless, of course, race trumps everything.

3 votes

#17.9 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:20 AM EDT

Yes and no 1devon, class destictions were at times just as ugly.

3 votes

#17.10 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:21 AM EDT

In West Side Story, The song America talked about all the wonders of life in America, "If you are all White in America."

The movie Gentleman's Agreement spoke of wide spread anti-Semitesm.

Billy Holiday sang of Southern trees bearing "strange fruit."

Native Americans were "drunken Indians" who should become White Christians.

It was a WASP's world, but even there the "boss" and the demand for conformity lead to lives of "quiet desperation."

Women were to stay home and worry their little heads only about "ring around the collar."

BBC had an interview (I cannot remember with whom, but I remember the line, "Arthur Miller asked," How should we live our lives?" Tennessee Williams asked," How do we make it through the night?"

Life was perfect on the surface.

2 votes

#17.11 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:29 AM EDT

I don't know. When you are considered a second class citizen on top of being poor, it's still an extra hurdle, imo. I don't know how it couldn't be. Class distinction with added racism had to be a horror story.

4 votes

#17.12 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 1:28 PM EDT

Agree 100% with you 1devon.

4 votes

#17.13 - Fri Jun 3, 2011 1:44 PM EDT

TheAmericanWay

The Vietnam war and civil rights were easy causes to rally behind. Taxes, the more limited wars and corruption is a little harder. People are trying though, like the Tea party and Unions. The students are too busy partying away.

1 vote

#18 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 9:44 AM EDT

"People are trying though, like the Tea party and Unions."

Personally, I don't see any correlation between the Tea Party and organized labor?????

5 votes

#18.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:30 AM EDT

TheAmericanWay

They are both made of people trying to participate in our Democracy.

3 votes

#18.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:33 AM EDT

Ok, I'll give you that, but from diametrically opposed points of view. By the way, this is not a democracy, but rather a representative republic that no longer represents the people.

7 votes

#18.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:40 AM EDT

By the way, this is not a democracy, but rather a representative republic that no longer represents the people.

Yeah, and we used to get lectured all the time by our current President until he started campaigning again. lol

3 votes

#18.4 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:41 PM EDT

The students are too busy partying away.

yeah, there's nothing like a good conscription/draft bill to get them moving. Any kid would march for that rally!

6 votes

#18.5 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 4:26 PM EDT

PigeonReport

The American Way: I know exactly what you are saying rally folk around given tax cut to billionaires is a lot more difficult that stopping angry white Confederate Flag waving anti-prostestors from beatng the life out of black folks and those pany-waisted while college kids that join them on their protest marches through out the "DEEP SOUTH."

Just the other day, I was at the VA hospital getting some cheap drugs from war veterans too weak to realize that I was purloining their, when I enraged a group of amputees by telling them that they had to get off of their "SOCIALISTIC SUCKING DEMOCRAT ARSEAS" AND START PULLING THEMSELVES UP BY THEIR OWN BOOT STRAPS."

Several rude amputees screamed at me during my impromptu TOWN HALL Tea & Nuts Meeting that they don't have and F-word arms to pull their boot straps up with, and, others claimed that they didn't have any bootstraps because they don't have any boots or feet.

Obviously, these lazy, government parasites were not CONSERVATIVE, GOD FEARING RIGHT WING REPUBLICANS like you an me.

4 votes

#18.6 - Sat Jun 4, 2011 7:46 PM EDT

Let me get this straight Pigeon.

Did you just say you were at the VA hospital to solicit some cheap drugs? If that is so.....you're wondering why anyone there was bothered by you?

You kinda lost me when I read that. lmao

1 vote

#18.7 - Sat Jun 4, 2011 8:53 PM EDT

Personally, I don't see any correlation between the Tea Party and organized labor?????

I think the correlation is that both groups are organized to stand up for what they think is fair treatment.

2 votes

#18.8 - Sat Jun 4, 2011 8:59 PM EDT

Organized Labor fights for worker's rights...government regulation of workplace and treatment of employees.

TP against gov regs...shrink gov-libertarian wing of the 'pubs.

In #18, TP fighting taxes, students against war (?), don't know where unions fit in. Who's fighting corruption? Does it mean unions are, or are they corrupt-not exactly clear.

They're both standing up for what they believe in...but aren't we all? Oh, except for the students, according to #20 :}

PigeonReport-dripping with vulgarized sarcasm-must be opposite day and I didn't get the memo. I got his point though.

3 votes

#18.9 - Sat Jun 4, 2011 9:33 PM EDT

PigeonReport

Amen, brother.

As Reverend Oral Fleece says the Tea Party is for mean white folks that hate government, Blacks, Hispanics, Jews, Native Americans and Pigeons.

Unions only hate people that aren't in their union. I was in the Soviet Union but they through me and Oswald out t different time. Said that I ate too much bread crumbs and the government couldn't feed its people.

4 votes

#18.10 - Sat Jun 4, 2011 9:48 PM EDT

The Tea Party basically doesn't like any one outside of their group either. lol

2 votes

#18.11 - Sun Jun 5, 2011 12:12 AM EDT

BergHerbertDeleted

Dahlia-2362973

...you better get the damn ball rolling. Get off your phone, get off you butt and dance, shake your fist and scream out there in the strrets where the people, the media, the politicians and the power brokers can see you, the crowd scares the $hit out of them.

the 20-somethings do not understand how the issues of today (union busting, medicare, limited wars, etc) can and will affect them. The really bright ones are coming out of college and finding some pretty good jobs. Many others are relying on the new health care law to provide health care insurance until they find a job that will give them insurance. They are not in danger of being drafted for an unjust war. They don't feel the sense of urgency to get out there on the streets like back in the sixties -

I was heartened by the spontaneous "celebrations" on college campuses when the bin Laden chapter was closed - these kids were in 4th, 5th, and 6th grades when 9/11 happened - they grew up with the terrorists' threats -

I agree that if this generation could rally and stand up for a cause, it could go a long way toward making the politicians take notice -

2 votes

#20 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT

BergHerbert #19 spammer alert!!!!!!

1 vote

#21 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 10:46 AM EDT

Bad Fish

I have been waiting my whole life for this! At 4:20 let's take to the streets in a blaze of protest to the establishment. Rage against Corporatism, Government corruption, and all our failed wars. All we need now is a folk singer with a bad voice.

6 votes

#22 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT

IndependentAmerican2892850

I like folk music and blue grass!!!!! Watch it Bad Fish! lol

3 votes

#22.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 12:43 PM EDT

Bad Fish

I hate green day but love the cover Corn Bread Red does of Boulevard of Broken Dreams. I like the blue grass. As for the folk singers who just couldn't be great songwriters without crooning with no talent......swallow rocks!

2 votes

#22.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 1:56 PM EDT

Perhaps, this time the revolution will be televised...

1 vote

#23 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:07 PM EDT

Bad Fish

I just signed a contract with MTV for my reality show Bad Fish Revolution. It will be on TV. To get the deal i had to introduce my family and we all had to act like Toothless Inbreds from an episode of Cops Fema Trailers! We stuffed my wife's bra with toilet paper and took away my kid's shoes. Shaved splotches of fur on the dog and let it run loose. I faked the fight with my wife where i was drunk and stood on the porch with a shotgun telling them, "If i can't have her, No bodies can!"

4 votes

#23.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 2:27 PM EDT

IndependentAmerican2892850

COPS FEMA Trailers...priceless!

#23.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 5:38 PM EDT

socialjustice

Well said.

The 50's is right.

There haven't been this many Republicans in office since 1952.

54 out of 99 State Legislatures, 29 out of 50 Governorships, the House of Representatives, filibuster control in the US Senate, and 4 out of 9 Supreme Court Justices, with one who leans right.

And these Republicans are nothing like Ike.

President Eisenhower created jobs with one of the biggest infrastructure improvements in our History, the Interstate Highway System.

Today, we can't even maintain our roads, bridges and levees because of the Republican pledge to never raise taxes, even while their economic policies have brought us 14 trillion in debt, and doubled our debt under George W. Bush.

President Eisenhower integrated the public schools.

Today's Republicans attack Civil Rights as their number one social agenda.

President Eisenhower first proposed the plan now derailed by Republicans as Obama Care.

President Eisenhower maintained a top tax rate of 90%.

Today's Republicans would pass the Death Panel Bill, known as the Ryan Plan, to end Medicare for future seniors and give more tax cuts to the wealthy.

http://readingeagle.com/article.aspx?id=194115

The Eisenhower-Nixon-Reagan-Bush-Bush healthcare plan passes

By Craig J. Cantoni

By Nov. 8, 2009

http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/Opinion/061130-2009-11-08-the-eisenhowernixonreaganbushbush-healthcare-plan-passes.htm

3 votes

#24 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:03 PM EDT

They would call Ike a Rino now.

3 votes

#24.1 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:08 PM EDT

IndependentAmerican2892850

You're being kind. They call Ike a liberal socialist now.

6 votes

#24.2 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:10 PM EDT

When there was a movement afoot to add former President Reagan to Mt. Rushmore, I wanted to vomit. My vote would have been for Eisenhower or FDR, or both.

4 votes

#24.3 - Wed Jun 1, 2011 6:51 PM EDT

Oh my. Where is Barry Goldwater when you need him?

1 vote

#24.4 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 2:16 PM EDT

PigeonReport

Sing Vlad dog, Sing!

But will the Children of the Corn-Hole Playing Generation, the last Wal-mart indoctrinated ones put down their I-pads long enough to cast a vote. And, led by the "Leave It To Beaver", Mad As Hell Tea-Republicans pissed off because Crying Johnnie Boehner sent their jobs overseas to China understand that it wasn't Democrats that wanted to go to China and work for $6.00 per day, but, the uber rich billionaire Conservative Republicans that said we have to have a "FREE MARKET" ECONOMY BECAUSE AYN RAND claimed it so? Will they understand or know?

And, their Born-Again Pastor, Terry, tells them that GOD WANTS THEM TO VOTE REPUBLICAN because the President is black and a socialist and a non-American-born in Kenya ---did I say black man. And God isn't.

he "Leave It To Beaver", black and white TV-ers and their off-off off spring need to find an outlet for their pent up bile,and,they wants revenge mfor their missing jobs, dead in hopes, lousey career choices.

Rush Limbergercheese has taught them HATE and with Glenn Beck and Fox TV they have been indoctrinated watching 24/7.

These Children of the Corn learned that with a bible in one hand and a rifle in the other, it's OK to kill a non-believer, abortion-loving Demon-crat - cause you are doing it for the Born Aain, Talking In Tongues, Evangelical Christian God of Pat Robertson, George W. Bush and Dick Cheney. b

"Blood Libel" Sarah Palin ask little, offers less and if they stay home will be their boss and there will be plenty of $6.00 jobs in America and even higher paying ones in China.

4 votes

#25 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 2:31 AM EDT

Carolyn-3170946

We old hippies really did shake things up. Even though the 50s were better than, say, the 30s when a person without a whooptiedooh wardrobe could not attend college, the 50s were so hypocritical and rigid. Abuse of women was more upfront (even encouraged), now it's gone underground, but it still exists. Reproduction was a taboo subject, even our tv shows had those twin beds for adults.

The 60s brought many new ideas forth.

Organic farming ... remember the Whole Earth Catalog? Geodesic homes, energy efficiency. We recognized in the 60s that our dependence on foreign oil was not a positive thing.
Civil Rights ... We took the phrase "All men are created equal." to fight racial and gender injustice. It was not easy. Although we were naive at times, we were brave. Many people died during these protests and marches. Students were fired upon and killed at Ohio State University, sung about it Neil Young's song "Ohio".
Space exploration ... We set what seemed impossible goals and achieved them by sending astronauts into space. The research to fulfill this dream ended up providing transistor radios, fire-proof pajamas for babies, computers ... and so much more.
Society ... We worked on developing more meaningful personal relationships, ones that fostered respect for individuality in a relationship. We refused to accept that "any marriage is a good marriage" for ourselves and our children. We began focusing more on like interests and education. Yes, we made "love, not war", but most of us weren't fake about it. We had (probably still have) a genuine deep abiding affection for one another in personal relationships as well as society as a whole. We broadened our spiritual horizons by respecting other cultures. In short, we were more tolerant and less judgmentall than what I see today.
Education ... We fought for better educations. The GI Bill came about. We changed the dress code that had kept so many out of universities.
War ... The draft existed, so ALL the men served, unless there was a good reason otherwise. Because every family paid a price for war, social consciousness about war peaked. We saw some senators and congressmen send their children to Canada or overseas to avoid participation in wars, leaving the brunt to the poor and disenfranchised.

7 votes

#26 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 8:51 AM EDT

You make some good points, but I have to disagree with some of the specifics.

The GI Bill came about.

The GI bill was instituted during WWII, in the 40s, not the 60s. Lots and lots of WWII vets who wouldn't otherwise been able to go to universities got their degrees after the war.

The draft existed, so ALL the men served, unless there was a good reason otherwise.

This was true during WWII. Rich, poor, average Joes, movie stars and famous athletes all were drafted and went to war. So many baseball players were drafted that the Major League went on hiatus. Nobody was special, nobody got out of it when they were called up unless they had medical issues.

Compare that to the Vietnam era when middle class kids could get draft deferments as long as they stayed in college, nobody famous got drafted and the rich could pay for their kids to stay out of the war zone by getting them into the National Guard. (Think George W. Bush and Dan Quayle.)

While it is true that there were exceptions, for the most part Vietnam was a poor man's war.

5 votes

#26.1 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 10:40 AM EDT

The draft wasn't disputed or fought against in WWII because everyone believed they had and should go to war. Most men wanted to be drafted. Two completely different wars. During the civil war though, there were many men who ran from the draft.

5 votes

#26.2 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 11:36 AM EDT

True. And in the Civil War it was legal to pay someone to take your place in the draft.

4 votes

#26.3 - Thu Jun 2, 2011 12:04 PM EDT